Dr. Jordan Grumet’s work as a hospice doctor has led to deep discussions with patients on the role purpose plays in a life.
That experience, paired with his connection to people in the FIRE movement, which stands for “financial independence, retire early,” launched him into personal finance blogging and becoming the host of the “Earn & Invest” podcast six years ago.
Grumet offered insights and advice in a conversation with Yahoo Finance. Here are edited highlights of that conversation:
Kerry Hannon: Why does the idea of finding your purpose freak people out so much?
Jordan Grumet: They see it as this difficult, unattainable thing that they can’t grasp their hands around. People say, ‘I don’t know what my purpose is.’ ‘How do I build a life of purpose when I don’t even know what that is?’
It makes them anxious, and they say, ‘you know what, I’m not even going to try.’
The fact is that you don’t find purpose. You build or create purpose from little inklings inside, and it can change over time.
Not to be jaded, but purpose is such a clichéd word. Is it all it’s cracked up to be?
Having a sense of purpose in life is associated with health, happiness, and longevity. The problem is it’s also associated with anxiety, as I said. We get purpose wrong because we make it into that ‘big P’ purpose — that huge thing. We set these goals that we can’t meet, and it’s frustrating.
Purpose should be something much simpler, smaller, and understandable. What I call ‘little p’ purpose, or things you can do on an everyday basis that light you up.
How does the search for purpose relate to your work as a hospice doctor?
Something really interesting happens when people find out that they’re dying. All of a sudden they become very clear on what was important to them. So I talk to people a lot about regrets. The dying spend a lot of time thinking about those things they wish they had done — impactful things that lead to a great legacy where we leave parts of us behind in the people we love.
What role does purpose play in our work lives?
There are some people who are uniquely lucky and develop a deep sense of purpose and end up working in that field, and they live happily ever after.
That is not the majority. We have all these voices telling us what purpose should look like in our life, from TikTok to our families. And often they are big, audacious versions of purpose.
There is a subset of people who will quit that job and go try to find something that’s more purposeful, but that’s not the reality that is tangible for most people.
You have to search for purpose anchors. It could be as simple as building that into your life outside of work to start with: It’s a great hobby, and it’s fun, and it fills you up. You still go to that job you don’t like.
Or your side purpose project starts generating some revenue, and you can start subtracting out some of your time at work. Maybe you go part-time, maybe you work four days a week instead of five.
Another option is to bring ‘little p’ purpose into your job. I have a friend who didn’t love her job. She became interested in women’s issues in the workplace and started putting on presentations for people at her work around those topics. People liked them and noticed.
One day her boss asked her to cut down to 75% of what work she had been doing and spend the rest of her time creating courses aligned with women and work for the corporate community. Now 25% of her work is doing something that feels deeply purposeful and important to her.
“The fact is that you don’t find purpose,” says author Jordan Grumet. “You build or create purpose from little inklings inside, and it can change over time.” (Photo courtesy of Jordan Grumet)
What role does community play in developing purpose in our lives?
We learn from the people around us. I call this generational growth where our parents model a behavior about what purpose looks like, and we try that on and decide if it fits or not. But it doesn’t have to be a parent. It could be a mentor, a friend, someone in your social group. So that’s a way we can try on these versions of purpose.
When I was a doctor, it was a ‘big P’ purpose in many ways, but it didn’t light me up and excite me. I didn’t have a lot of doctor friends. When I started doing personal finance and then started writing and podcasting, it was a ‘little p’ purpose, but it lit me up.
Can you elaborate on the role of purpose in the financial independence movement community that’s a big part of your story?
When I became part of the financial independence community, it did two things for me. One is it gave me some of the vocabulary and knowledge and tools to realize that money is a tool that I can use to live the life I want.
I was then able to create a life in which I could use that money to do things I want to do. Money is a great tool to help us start practicing and living this life of ‘little p’ purpose.
But the other thing for me is the FIRE community became the place that I created content and realized my ‘little p’ purpose and created community myself. Because I was so lit up and excited about communicating, writing, podcasting, and blogging about personal finance, it connected me to these other creators. They eventually helped me, for instance, get a book deal and they came on my podcast and I would go on their podcast. This is the way we create those connections that help us and move us forward and help us pursue and further those things that are important to us.
As we look to 2025, what role can purpose play in our work and job goals?
The beginning of the year is a great time to look at what you want to do. You need to look back at your calendar and say, how did I spend my time in 2024? How much of that was purposeful activities, ‘little p’ purpose? How much of that was stuff I really don’t like? How much of it was stuff that was meh?
Then start looking to 2025 and saying, how can I improve that calendar with more joyful activities that can I get rid of?
We should be looking at our 2024 calendar and saying, how can we make 2025 a year where I do more ‘little p’ purpose?
